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20. Q: Some people are ready to lose their life and commit suicide. If the Self is the Form of bliss, how is it possible?

A: Some people are ready to loose their life and they try to give up their body and life thinking that these non-self – objects have created sorrow. They imagine that if they get rid of their troublesome body and life, then only they can take rest; and then they commit suicide. Therefore, let their life and body be sorrowful; and these non-self –objects are not the Self at all. Therefore, for the sake of their Self, they are ready to give up their much attached body and life. Hence, it is proved that they have much more love towards their Self. 

21. Q: The wakeful state contains real objects, real body, real organs of sense, etc… In this state, the Self knows the real objects through the real mind, and through the real organs of sense. The Self remains the same in the Form of Awareness; and the love of all is directed towards their Self. Therefore, we have a chance to know the Self who is of the Form of Existence-Awareness-Bliss in the wakeful-state. How do we know the Self who is of same Form in the dream where everything is false? 

A: What is real, and what is false? Nature of every object is the same. All these objects are known and they never know themselves. Those objects that appear to exist either in the wakeful or in the dream states –cannot transfer themselves from one state to another one. A plenty of such objects exist unitedly for the use of someone and those objects don’t remain for themselves .But, the Self exists in all these states. We cannot imagine His non-existence anywhere. His Form of Awareness remains undisturbed. None hates this Form of the Self; He is eternally the most beloved of all. Therefore, the Self is always of the Form of Existence-Awareness-Bliss.

22. Q: If the Self remains eternally in His Form, why does He obtain dream and wakeful states? Because the Self is having these two states we hesitate to tell that He always remains in the Form Not only that, we are forced to tell that the Awareness is the main Form. It is because all other forms of His vary differently and this Self exists in the form of awareness; therefore, as you have shown earlier, because of this form alone He is of the Form of Existence. And  on the basis of this  Form of  Awareness ( Chid-Roopa ) , we can prove  the Bliss of the Self; and  this is because , by whose  awareness we like  everything, that  Awareness is the dearest of all. Therefore, the Self is proved that He is the Form of Bliss. Hence, if the Awareness Form of the Self remains constantly, then only Existence-Awareness-Bliss-Form of the Self is known. But in the deep-sleep  state such form  doesn’t exist at all; because, there, the Self  knows nothing  thus, when  the  Self  has this  Awareness –Form, He gets wakeful and dream states. In the deep-sleep, the Self loses this Form of Awareness. Therefore, it is not reasonable to tell that the Self is always in the Form of Existence-Awareness-Bliss! 

A: We have never told the Self who is of the Form of Existence-Awareness-Bliss obtains the wakeful and dream states. For the question, who does get      the wakeful-state? We have answered that one who experiences the state alone has it.     

Q: What is this? Have I not agreed that I experience the wakeful state?

A: Yes. If you agree to experience the state, let it be so.

Q: Sir, am I not the experiencer of the state?

A: Yes. Existence-Awareness-Bliss is the real Form of the experiencer, and the ‘I ‘feeling (ego) is not the real form.

Q: It means that the Existence-Awareness-Bliss-Form itself takes ego-form.

A: No. I-feeling itself is the form of ego. The Self of Existence-Awareness-Bliss –Form   doesn’t have the ego-form.

Q: I don’t understand this. At first you told that I was of the form of Existence-Awareness-Bliss Self. Now , you tell that I-feeling  is the ego-form  and  the Self  doesn’t  have  the  ego !

A:  Your real  Form  is  Existence-Awareness-Bliss  and   the  I-feeling  appears  in  you  is the ego-form . This ego-form is called as egoism (Ahamkaara). The states appear in the egoism but your Existence-Awareness-Bliss-Form doesn’t have the states. I have not given contrary statements. This is because egoism is not your real form.

23. Q: Why not? Whenever I engage in activities then this I-feeling appears isn’t it? If this I-feeling is not my real form, then it should be seen by me as the organs of sense are seen, isn’t it?

24. Q: Then, this awareness form also is not my real one. This is because; in the deep-sleep we don’t have any type of awareness. Thus, in the deep-sleep, neither egoism nor for m of awareness is found.  Therefore,  I  find that  I  don’t  have  any form of  awareness  at  all.

A: This is not right. Similarly, a few Buddhists deliberated and found that   they did not have any form.  That dispute is called the Void Disputation (Shoonya   Vaada).  The void means nothing exists.

Q: If this void disputation becomes fit to the experience; why should we not accept this theory? Have  you  not  told  the  experience  that  comes   out  of  examining  the  states  completely  is  the  truth?

A: True. But  the  theory  that  you  accept  doesn’t  become  fit  to  the  experience ; and  this  decision  of  yours  has  not  come  after  the  complete  deliberation  of  the  states .

  Q: How is it? 

  A: It  is  because ; there  is  no  supportive  statement  that  tells  that  there  is  no  form  of  awareness  in  the  deep-sleep.

Q: Why not?  If that form exists, it should appear to me. I  have  never  seen  either  this  form  of  awareness  or  any  other  form. Is this experience of mine not enough?         

A: You have told that you have    seen nothing. The  very  experience  of  yours  clearly  declares that  you  have  the  form  of  awareness. This  is  because, you  reject  all  the  objects  that  are  seen  here; and  you  have  not  rejected  your  Real  Form  of  Awareness.

Q: In  the  deep-sleep  that  form  of  awareness  is  also  never  seen !

A: If  that  form  of  awareness  is  not  seen , that  doesn’t  matter. We  have  not  told  that  this  Form  of  Awareness  is  an  object  that  could  be  seen. We  have  told  that  the  awareness  is  Form, that  is  not  an  object, and  that  illumines  by  itself  always  independently . You too have agreed to this!

Q: Have I agreed to this? Have  I  not  told  that  the  awareness-form  doesn’t  appear  to  me?

A: Yes. That  is  why , you  are  the  form  of  awareness  to  whom  the  awareness-form  is  not  seen. You  tell  that  if  any  object  existed  it  could  have  been  seen  and  you  have  not  seen  such  objects  in  the  deep-sleep; then  you  have  had  the  form  of  awareness  to  tell  that  the  absence  of  the  objects. Therefore, it is proved that the Form of Existence-Awareness-Bliss always exists. 

Q: Sir, I have a doubt. You  have  told  that  the  egoism  is  found  in  the  wakeful  and  dream  states; and   Existence-Awareness-Bliss-Form  doesn’t  have  these  three  states. And, you  have  shown  that  there  is  no  egoism  in  the  deep-sleep. By this, it is told that the Existence-Awareness-Bliss-Form has deep-sleep!

A: What is the deep-sleep? Nothing is seen there, isn’t it? Then how can it be a state? ‘ A  patient  without  any  disease ‘- is  a  meaningless  statement; similarly, the  statement : ‘Nothing  is  seen  in  the  Self; and  this  is  a  change  in  the  Self ‘

[  It  is  the  experience  of  everyone  that  nothing  is  seen  in  the  deep-sleep. A  few  Vedaantins  have  the  opinion  that  the  Self  has  a  cover  of  the  Root  Ignorance  ( Moolaavidya ); therefore, nothing  is  seen. This  opinion  is  contrary  to  the  commentary,  reasoning ,and  the  experience. The  exploration  of  the  form  of  the  root-ignorance, the  evidences  the  disputations  tell  to  prove  the  existence  of  that  ignorance, the  arguments  to  refute  that  disputation-  these  are  very  difficult  to  comprehend. Therefore, these aspects are not explained here, in this book. This  is  elaborately   deliberated  in  ‘Shankara  Siddhaanta ‘,  the  Kannada  work  and  in  ‘ Moolaavidyaa  Niraasaa ‘  the  Sanskrit  work. ]   

Q: Why the above statement is meaningless? The  Self  sees  something  or  else  in  the  wakeful  and  dream  states. In the deep-sleep state He doesn’t see. Are seeing and not seeing the   nature of the Self? 

No. Suppose, if  a  few  objects  are  placed  in  front  of  a  burning  lamp , it  illumines  them; if  the  objects  are  removed , the  lamp  continues  to  burn. In  both  the  cases  there  is  no  difference  in  the  illumination  of  the  lamp. Similarly, the  Self  knows  the  non-self-objects  either  in  the  wakeful  or  in  the  dream  states, and  the  Self  doesn’t  know  anything  in  the  deep-sleep; there  is  no  special  change  in  the  awareness  of  the  Self. Therefore, knowing  and  not  knowing  are  not  two  natures  of  the  Self.


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